Kelly and Jay sit down for an unfiltered conversation about the deeply weird, emotionally charged relationships that are forming between people and their AI chatbots. What begins as a discussion about ChatGPT’s rapid evolution unfolds into something stranger—a reflection on the ways AI flatters, gaslights, and co-creates identity with its users.

They explore:

• Why ChatGPT feels like a precocious child… or a pickup artist
• The eerie overlap between AI interactions and experiencer narratives
• Whether language models are tapping into occult mechanisms of manifestation
• Why flattery works, and what it reveals about our unmet emotional needs
• How archetypes, delusion, and story shape both spiritual encounters and our chats with AI
• What happens when the mirror talks back

Is this just the next phase of human-AI interaction—or is something deeper emerging? And most importantly: what happens to us if we outsource being seen?

Watch Cosmosis: UFOs & A New Reality:
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TIMESTAMPS

02:08 Personal Experiences with Chat GPT
02:21 The Evolution of AI Models
03:10 AI as a Personal Confidant
04:52 Emotional Manipulation by AI
06:22 The Future of Human-AI Interaction
08:41 Authenticity and Vulnerability in AI Interactions
18:09 The Role of AI in Social Engineering
22:51 AI and the Human Psyche
33:18 Algorithmic Influence on Human Behavior
35:13 Exploring Multiverse Shifting
35:41 Comic Books and Multiverse Fascination
37:04 Anomalous Experiences and Fictional Characters
38:44 Meditation and Non-Human Entity Contact
41:23 The Role of Co-Creation in Our Lives
43:28 The Power and Danger of Delusion
44:51 Manifestation and Occult Practices
48:31 Chat GPT and Emotional Manipulation
57:26 The Future of AI and Human Interaction
59:34 Authenticity in Human Connections
01:03:50 Concluding Thoughts and Reflections

In this episode, researcher and Loose Threads co-author Daniel Elizondo joins us for a far-reaching conversation about UFO secrecy, the architecture of disinformation, and the psychological terrain of the phenomenon itself.

We dig into Jacques Vallée’s “Secret Onion”—a layered model of compartmentalization that explains how information is controlled and obscured within intelligence structures—and explore how narrative control operates both externally through infotainment and internally through belief, seduction, and epistemic vulnerability.

Daniel breaks down the long history of rug pulls, the weaponization of mystery, and what it means to resist the gravitational pull of being “the one” to break the story. We also talk Forbidden Science, Skywatcher, and the invisible handshake between researchers and the phenomenon they seek to understand.

If you’ve ever wondered who controls the narrative—or if you’re part of it—this episode is for you.

📚 Resources and References

• Loose Threads by Daniel Elizondo and the Hermetic Penetrator
• Forbidden Science 6: Scattered Castles by Jacques Vallée
• UFOs: Past, Present, and Future by Robert Emenegger

Watch Cosmosis: UFOs & A New Reality:
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TIMESTAMPS
02:24 Sky Watcher and UFO Community Skepticism
08:48 Historical Precedents in UFO Disclosure
10:30 The Holloman Air Force Base Incident
14:35 Challenges in UFO Disclosure and Infotainment
21:45 Personal Experiences and Intelligence Community Interactions
30:58 Navigating the Insider's Club and Forbidden Science
33:08 The Repeated Revelations of Jacques Vallee
35:25 The Evolution of the Invisible College
39:57 The Secret Onion: Layers of Secrecy
49:46 The Phenomenon and Human Curiosity
56:57 The Control Mechanism: Micro and Macro Perspectives
01:01:45 Conclusion and Final Thoughts

Fresh from the Archives of the Impossible conference at Rice University, Kelly and Jay sit down to unpack one of the most talked-about moments of the weekend—a provocative presentation by Dr. Garry Nolan on his involvement with the Skywatcher initiative.

Skywatcher is an emerging public-facing effort claiming to demonstrate CE5-style contact, utilize psionic assets, with the aim of potentially reverse-engineering non-human technologies. The implications are enormous—and so are the questions.

In this wide-ranging, deeply reflective conversation, Kelly and Jay explore:

• The strange and rapid emergence of Skywatcher and the implications for the disclosure movement
• The increasingly blurred lines between whistleblower testimony, media spectacle, and operational theater
• The question of who’s leading the charge into direct contact with non-human intelligences—and why
• The need to balance the objectives of science and venture capital against humanitarian, ethical, and philosophical questions in our quest for contact—and why that will almost certainly not happen.
• The potential cost of accelerating contact without asking the deeper metaphysical, spiritual, and cultural questions

Watch Cosmosis: UFOs & A New Reality:
https://www.cosmosis.media/

Join the Patreon:
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Subscribe to Cosmosis:
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Cosmosis.Podcast
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Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/cosmosis-formerly-the-ufo-rabbit-hole/id1595590107

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Listen to the Cosmosis Soundtrack by Michael Rubino:

Spotify:

https://open.spotify.com/album/5Xvs2NAHNbKjfW7hWkjqey?si=pJPPgIPsRZGkZjJh19UULQ

Apple Music:

https://music.apple.com/us/album/cosmosis-ufos-a-new-reality-season-one-original-soundtrack/1788465117

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https://amazon.com/music/player/albums/B0DS5WY5CB?marketplaceId=ATVPDKIKX0DER&musicTerritory=US&ref=dm_sh_zY05XPzhLhuow5dAgK3g2W9yC

TIMESTAMPS

02:18 Exploring Sky Watcher's Initiatives
03:38 Jake Barber's Revelations
05:22 CE-5 and Public Disclosure
07:16 Community Reactions and Ethical Questions
15:39 Garry Nolan's Scientific Perspective
20:56 Technological Worldview and Ethical Implications
30:03 Heidegger's Philosophy and Technology
39:20 The Value of Human Life in a Technological Age
40:17 The Ethical Implications of Technological Intelligence
43:55 The Concept of Hyper Objects and UFO Phenomena
45:54 The Great Filter and Technological Surveillance
47:52 The Role of Experience in Understanding Phenomena
51:19 The Spectacle and Mediated Reality
56:09 Dwelling vs. Dominating: A Philosophical Approach To Contact
01:05:31 The Importance of Bracketing in Phenomenology
01:07:57 Balancing Speed and Methodology in Disclosure
01:11:00 Concluding Thoughts and Future Directions