Should a good copywriter make you rich?

If you've ever wondered whether your copywriter is actually good, this episode gives you permission to stop measuring by the wrong metrics.

I had such an interesting conversation in a Voxer chat that I knew I had to bring it to the podcast:
"Should I evaluate how good a conversion copywriter is by how much revenue they generate?"

This got me thinking about everything I've learned and experienced over the last seven years as a DFY conversion copywriter. The truth is, most founders don't know how to evaluate whether a copywriter is actually good. So they reach for the easiest metric: revenue.

In this episode, we're breaking down what actually determines whether a conversion copywriter is doing good work, why revenue isn't always the right measure, and how you can know if you're getting real value from your investment in copywriting. Whether you're considering hiring a copywriter or you're already working with one and wondering if it's actually working, this is a practical, honest conversation you need to hear.

This is for you if you’ve wondered:

• Is my copywriter actually good, or is the problem somewhere else in my funnel?
• Should I be evaluating a copywriter based on the revenue they generate?
• If a copywriter is so talented, why aren't they rich themselves?
• How do I know if the copy did its job?
• What am I actually supposed to measure when hiring or evaluating a copywriter?
• Is it possible that great copy exists inside a broken marketing system?
• Who is responsible for marketing results?

➡️ SHOW NOTES: Grab all the links and resources mentioned in this episode on the blog here! https://www.megankachigan.com/hire-conversion-copywriter-metrics

FREE RESOURCE: Copy not converting? Increase your conversion rate in 5-minutes a day when you join my free 5-day challenge “Why Isn’t This Converting?”

CONNECT WITH MEGAN:
Join My Inbox Community → www.megankachigan.com/email
Website → www.megankachigan.com
LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/in/megan-kachigan-loehr-9957684b/
Threads → https://www.threads.net/@megankachigan

Instagram → https://www.instagram.com/megankachigan/

Join the Why Isn't This Converting?" Free 5-Day challenge to get more clients from your copy by clicking here!

Know exactly what to fix in your copywriting with this "Why Isn't This Converting?" Free 5-Day Challenge. You'll get bite-sized email prompts where you’ll apply one simple, high-impact fix in just minutes to make your content convert without having to re-write everything or constantly guess at what's going to work.

What is your email data actually telling you? It's probably not "write better subject lines."

A recent client consultation turned into a masterclass on what really kills email open rates. One company watched their performance crash from 30% to 15%...and the answer wasn't hiding in the copywriting.

In this episode, I'm taking you behind the scenes of a real email diagnosis and showing you the three strategic questions that separate a real marketing solution from a surface-level band-aid.

What You'll Learn:

• The mistake most copywriters make when email performance tanks (and why it costs you weeks of wasted effort)
• The one operational change that tanked a client's open rates (and how to check if this is happening to you right now)
• Why sender reputation matters more than subject line testing…and the data that proves it
• How to work with a copywriter or marketer who asks questions first instead of jumping straight to solutions
• The exact data points you need to look at before changing a single word of copy
• How one small email sequence bridged a recognition gap and restored email performance
• Why most email advice fails you, and what strategic email marketing actually looks like

➡️ SHOW NOTES: Grab all the links and resources mentioned in this episode on the blog here! https://www.megankachigan.com/3-questions-email-marketing-strategy

FREE RESOURCE: Copy not converting? Increase your conversion rate in 5-minutes a day when you join my free 5-day challenge “Why Isn’t This Converting?”

CONNECT WITH MEGAN:
Join My Inbox Community → www.megankachigan.com/email
Website → www.megankachigan.com
LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/in/megan-kachigan-loehr-9957684b/
Threads → https://www.threads.net/@megankachigan

Instagram → https://www.instagram.com/megankachigan/

Join the Why Isn't This Converting?" Free 5-Day challenge to get more clients from your copy by clicking here!

Know exactly what to fix in your copywriting with this "Why Isn't This Converting?" Free 5-Day Challenge. You'll get bite-sized email prompts where you’ll apply one simple, high-impact fix in just minutes to make your content convert without having to re-write everything or constantly guess at what's going to work.

Most experts don't realize their website is speaking a completely different language than their potential clients are searching for. 😮

The solution is usually pretty simple…

…but it’s easy to miss this entirely because you’re too close to your own work.

You know exactly what you do.
You understand your transformations inside and out.

But your potential clients are searching using very different words.

If your website isn't speaking their language, you're invisible to them where they are actively looking for someone like you.

Today I’m sharing my interview with Laura Jawad, an SEO strategist who helps service providers build stronger online reputations and connect with people actively searching for their services, on what is currently working in SEO (and the quick win you can get today!)

With a background as a PhD-trained scientist, Laura brings a research-minded, evidence-based perspective to visibility. She’s built two businesses through search herself, and now helps values-led entrepreneurs create long-term, reputation-driven visibility across both traditional search and emerging AI tools.

This is for you if you've been wondering:

• How do I actually attract clients (not just traffic) through SEO?
• What does a realistic content marketing strategy look like for a small business?
• Why does everyone say SEO takes 6–12 months? What am I supposed to do in the meantime?
• Is my website actually saying what I do in a way people can find?
• How do I create content that matters and ranks?

Let's dig in and make it work for you.

Join Laura's free webinar: Get Found in the Age of AI: What's Changed, What Hasn't, and What to Do First So That You Show Up Where Your People Are Searching. Attendees will leave with real, standalone value whether they enroll or decide to take what they learn and run with it on their own. (But trust me, Laura is brilliant - you do not want to miss this!)

➡️ SHOW NOTES: Grab all the links and resources mentioned in this episode on the blog here! https://www.megankachigan.com/seo-content-marketing-strategy-laura-jawad

CONNECT WITH MEGAN:
Join My Inbox Community → www.megankachigan.com/email
Website → www.megankachigan.com
LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/in/megan-kachigan-loehr-9957684b/
Threads → https://www.threads.net/@megankachigan

Instagram → https://www.instagram.com/megankachigan/

*Note: This may contain an affiliate link, which means if you click and buy, I'll earn a commission at no extra cost to you. I never recommend things I don't love or haven't used. 🫶

Join the Why Isn't This Converting?" Free 5-Day challenge to get more clients from your copy by clicking here!

Know exactly what to fix in your copywriting with this "Why Isn't This Converting?" Free 5-Day Challenge. You'll get bite-sized email prompts where you’ll apply one simple, high-impact fix in just minutes to make your content convert without having to re-write everything or constantly guess at what's going to work.

The funnels that are converting consistently are the ones that are thinking in terms of their ecosystem, not just one single funnel.

I've seen many smart business owners pour energy into single-funnel strategies—landing page, launch sequence, wait for conversions—only to hit a ceiling. The funnel would work for a time, then the momentum would fade. New customers came, but they rarely came back. Revenue felt inconsistent.

Destini Copp demonstrates a different way. Instead of pushing more launches or building more funnels, she teaches founders to start building systems that keep clients engaged, invested, and loyal.

We're diving into why traditional funnels plateau, what actually replaces constant launching, where tripwires and upsells fit into a bigger ecosystem, and why the founders who win are the ones who understand that the best funnels don't just convert once. They introduce clients to your full ecosystem—tripwires, upsells, memberships—so they stay longer and invest deeper.

If you've ever felt like you're one launch away from burnout, or if you've wondered why adding more offers seems to overwhelm people instead of excite them, this episode is for you.

IN THIS EPISODE, YOU'LL DISCOVER:

• The "flywheel" framework that replaced Destini's old funnel model (and why single funnels stop converting after a while)
• Why the founders who win aren't rebuilding their funnels every 6 months—and what they're doing differently
• How tripwires work when you think bigger than $7-$27 offers
• The email sequence that retargets people who didn't buy at checkout (and why timing matters more than you think)
• What "stacking" multiple upsells actually looks like in a real funnel (with numbers from her B2B and B2C brands)
• Why order bumps and strategic upsells feel less "salesy" when you frame them the right way
• How to diagnose which stage of your business needs optimization first (so you're not guessing)

ABOUT OUR GUEST, DESTINI COPP

Destini Copp is the founder of Hobby Scool and Creators MBA—two education brands that serve completely different audiences but use the same core growth system. She works with established experts, course creators, and membership owners who want to stop feeling overwhelmed by marketing and start building systems that generate consistent, predictable revenue without constant input.

Her signature framework—the Creator's Growth Flywheel—breaks down how to build businesses in five integrated stages: Attract → Engage → Nurture → Retain → Advocate.

Get Destini's Creator's Growth Flywheel Diagnostic (use this to figure out which stage of your business needs attention first)

Join the Why Isn't This Converting?" Free 5-Day challenge to get more clients from your copy by clicking here!

Know exactly what to fix in your copywriting with this "Why Isn't This Converting?" Free 5-Day Challenge. You'll get bite-sized email prompts where you’ll apply one simple, high-impact fix in just minutes to make your content convert without having to re-write everything or constantly guess at what's going to work.

Most entrepreneurs think about their business book the wrong way. They count royalties, obsess over Amazon rankings, and then watch the book disappear from their marketing strategy the moment the launch hype fades.

When you're a business owner or a speaker, you're not writing a book to sell books. You're writing a book to build a long-term marketing asset—one that generates clients, visibility, and authority for 5 to 10 YEARS (not just 5 to 10 weeks).

In this episode, I'm talking with book strategist Holly Ostrout about what it actually takes to write a book that works for your business. We dig into the misconceptions that trip up smart entrepreneurs, the frameworks that make books convert, and why the funnel after the book matters more than the book itself.

In This Episode, We Talk About:

• Why 20% or less of your book revenue comes from actual book sales
• The biggest misconception entrepreneurs have about books (spoiler: it's not about bestseller status)
• Why most books fail to generate leads (and how the Heroine's Journey framework fixes it)
• How adult learning theory shapes a book that actually creates results
• The funnel strategy every business book needs on the back end
• The common denominator behind the books that keep selling.

CONNECT WITH OUR GUEST:
Stop being the best-kept secret and Write the Book That Makes You THE Authority in Only 6 Weeks. This will open doors your expertise alone can’t…the speaking gigs you’ve been pitching for, media visibility you’ve been building toward, and clients who show up to calls already sold on working with you.

→ Take the QUIZ: https://www.hollyostrout.com/quiz/
→ Connect with Holly on IG: https://www.instagram.com/hollyostrout/

CONNECT WITH MEGAN:
Join My Inbox Community → www.megankachigan.com/email
Website → www.megankachigan.com
LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/in/megan-kachigan-loehr-9957684b/
Threads → https://www.threads.net/@megankachigan

Instagram → https://www.instagram.com/megankachigan/

Join the Why Isn't This Converting?" Free 5-Day challenge to get more clients from your copy by clicking here!

Know exactly what to fix in your copywriting with this "Why Isn't This Converting?" Free 5-Day Challenge. You'll get bite-sized email prompts where you’ll apply one simple, high-impact fix in just minutes to make your content convert without having to re-write everything or constantly guess at what's going to work.

She's been booked out months in advance with a full client roster for 14 years in business. And she doesn't pay for ads or manage a large team.

I recently sat down with Jess Freeman, a web designer and SEO strategist and here's what she revealed about her marketing strategy that most service providers are missing:

Organic marketing isn't about finding the one "right" channel. Instead, it's about understanding which methods actually work for your business, and then doubling down on organic marketing strategies that compound over time.

In this episode, we dive into:

✓ Where her clients actually come from (and why it's different than you'd expect)
✓ How SEO became her form of self-care marketing (you will love this!)
✓ Why being found on ChatGPT is becoming more important (and NOW is the time to capitalize on it!)
✓ What Threads is best for as a business owner
✓ The blogging rhythm that actually works without burnout
✓ Why you should NOT use AI for keyword research (and what to do instead)

Let's dig into what’s actually working.

➡️ SHOW NOTES: Grab all the links and resources mentioned in this episode on the blog here! https://www.megankachigan.com/organic-marketing-strategy-jess-freeman

CONNECT WITH OUR GUEST: Join us at the Ordinary Business Summit on April 1-2, 2026. Jess and I will be speaking on a roundtable discussion about creating community as a business owner.

FREE RESOURCE: Copy not converting? Increase your conversion rate in 5-minutes a day when you join my free 5-day challenge “Why Isn’t This Converting?”

CONNECT WITH MEGAN:
Join My Inbox Community → www.megankachigan.com/email
Website → www.megankachigan.com
LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/in/megan-kachigan-loehr-9957684b/
Threads → https://www.threads.net/@megankachigan

Instagram → https://www.instagram.com/megankachigan/

Join the Why Isn't This Converting?" Free 5-Day challenge to get more clients from your copy by clicking here!

Know exactly what to fix in your copywriting with this "Why Isn't This Converting?" Free 5-Day Challenge. You'll get bite-sized email prompts where you’ll apply one simple, high-impact fix in just minutes to make your content convert without having to re-write everything or constantly guess at what's going to work.

For years, conversion copywriting has been treated as the gold standard in marketing.

If the landing page converts, the copy is working…right?

But what if conversion isn’t actually the most important metric anymore?

In this episode, I’m sharing why the copywriting is no long only about getting the sale. It also needs to speak to the right clients who stay.

Because if someone buys once and disappears, something in the marketing experience was misaligned.

Values-First Marketing shifts the focus from quick conversions to long-term relationships. And messaging that reflects your values clearly helps the right people recognize themselves in your work.

When that alignment exists, marketing becomes easier, trust builds faster, and clients stay longer.

What You Can Expect In This Episode:

• Why conversion rates don’t tell the full story about your marketing
• How Values-First Marketing filters the right clients before the sale
• The concept of trust velocity and why it matters now (no one is talking about this!)
• The difference between fear-based urgency and inherent urgency (and why it matters for your bottom line).
• Why copywriting isn’t actually about convincing people.
  
  

If your clients are giving you a headache, this episode will help you rethink what your messaging so that it brings in your best-fit clients that you love to serve!

➡️ SHOW NOTES: Grab all the links and resources mentioned in this episode on the blog here!

https://www.megankachigan.com/conversion-copywriting-retention-strategy

FREE RESOURCE: Copy not converting? Increase your conversion rate in 5-minutes a day when you join my free 5-day challenge “Why Isn’t This Converting?”

CONNECT WITH MEGAN:
Join My Inbox Community → www.megankachigan.com/email
Website → www.megankachigan.com
LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/in/megan-kachigan-loehr-9957684b/
Threads → https://www.threads.net/@megankachigan

Instagram → https://www.instagram.com/megankachigan/

Join the Why Isn't This Converting?" Free 5-Day challenge to get more clients from your copy by clicking here!

Know exactly what to fix in your copywriting with this "Why Isn't This Converting?" Free 5-Day Challenge. You'll get bite-sized email prompts where you’ll apply one simple, high-impact fix in just minutes to make your content convert without having to re-write everything or constantly guess at what's going to work.

When people ask how to promote your podcast, they’re usually asking the wrong question: How do I grow my downloads?

It’s easy to feel pressure while watching big name podcasters climbing charts, chasing downloads, and keeping up with social media trends.

…But is that actually the best way to promote your podcast?

If your podcast is part of a service-based business, those vanity metrics aren’t always the most important measure of success.

In this episode, I’m joined by podcast marketing strategist Amanda Bennett, who helps mom podcasters connect with the right listeners, partners, and clients. We talk about how relationship-based marketing, SEO, and simple systems can help your podcast become a true marketing asset…without requiring hours of your time every week.

If you’ve ever wondered how to promote your podcast in a way that actually leads to clients, partnerships, and long-term visibility, this conversation will give you a fresh perspective.

In this episode, we talk about:

• Why chasing podcast downloads can distract you from the metrics that actually grow your business
• What Amanda recommends doing if you only have 30 minutes a week to promote your podcast
• The surprising reason relationship marketing grows podcasts faster than algorithms
• How podcast SEO helps the right listeners discover your show
  The difference between growing a podcast audience and building a podcast that supports your business
• A simple way to turn your podcast into a funnel that leads listeners into clients.
• Why “unscalable” marketing actions often create the biggest results for podcasters
• Where AI can help podcasters save time (and where it can hurt your credibility)

If you want to grow your podcast while being surrounded by other moms who *get it *, get your tickets to the April 2026 Podcasting Moms Conference in Nashville!

➡️ SHOW NOTES: Grab all the links and resources mentioned in this episode on the blog here!

https://www.megankachigan.com/promote-your-podcast-to-get-more-clients-amanda-bennett

FREE RESOURCE: Copy not converting? Let’s change that in just 5 minutes a day.

CONNECT WITH MEGAN:
Join My Inbox Community → www.megankachigan.com/email
Website → www.megankachigan.com
LinkedIn → https://www.linkedin.com/in/megan-kachigan-loehr-9957684b/
Threads → https://www.threads.net/@megankachigan

Instagram → https://www.instagram.com/megankachigan/

Join the Why Isn't This Converting?" Free 5-Day challenge to get more clients from your copy by clicking here!

Know exactly what to fix in your copywriting with this "Why Isn't This Converting?" Free 5-Day Challenge. You'll get bite-sized email prompts where you’ll apply one simple, high-impact fix in just minutes to make your content convert without having to re-write everything or constantly guess at what's going to work.