In this episode of our APMM series, we dive into the evolving world of local government leadership. I'm thrilled to be joined by three distinguished guests: Tom Fountaine, George Needles, and Dave Kratzer. Together, they bring decades of experience and deep insight into the challenges and opportunities shaping municipal management today.

In our conversation, we cover:

• The growing complexity of public expectations and the rise of instant communication in the digital age.

• Navigating governance challenges, from polarization to the need for greater professionalization in local government.

• The competition for talent and what it means for the future of the profession.

• And finally the need to Advocate for statutory protections and employment agreements to ensure stability and address leadership volatility.

Whether you’re a municipal manager, elected official, or someone curious about the dynamics of local governance, this episode offers valuable insights on leadership, adaptability, and the profession’s future.

APMM Website (Upcoming Executive Conference Info)

APMM LinkedIN

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Tom Fountaine

David Kratzer Jr

George Needles

Duration of Employment Agreements (Starting: [00:00:00])

• "The limitation in the statute that doesn't allow local municipalities to make their own decisions about that issue is not a good statute...those decisions should be made by local governing bodies." - Tom

Increased Interaction with Elected Officials (Starting: [00:03:00])

• "I probably spend more time today working directly with elected officials, communicating with elected officials, attending meetings with elected officials...than I did when I started in this career." - Tom

Impact of Polarization and Social Media (Starting: [00:04:00])

• "The polarization of the world has really made this work much different than it used to be 20 or 30 years ago." - Tom

Evolving Public Expectations (Starting: [00:07:00])

• "People consume communication so many different ways now that there is an expectation that we can deliver in their way that they can consume and we can deliver that very quickly." - George

Faster Information Flow (Starting: [00:09:00])

• "With quicker access to information...it puts more importance on making sure that those charged with governance, the elected officials, are aware of that information before it becomes generally available." - Dave

The Competition for Talent (Starting: [00:12:00])

• "Competition for talent...is not only a function of competition within the sector but also other opportunities that may present for those that have functioned well in this position." - Dave

Standardization Challenges in Pennsylvania Governance (Starting: [00:16:00])

• "We operate under codes, right? But we're not highly standardized...No two [local governments] are similar." - George

Governance Fragmentation and Managerial...

Today we explore how adaptive thinking, emotional intelligence, and innovative frameworks like the OODA loop and Cynefin transform problem-solving are impacting policing. Lou Hayes Jr., a detective sergeant, and complexity facilitator Gary Wong share insights on navigating uncertainty, fostering trust, and rethinking traditional approaches to leadership. Perfect for leaders, law enforcement professionals, and anyone tackling complex challenges.

Nancy Hess, Host of PCC Local Time

Lou Hayes , Jr. (LinkedIn)

• The Illinois Model

Gary Wong (LinkedIn)

• Welcome to My Brain

IDEAS/ RESOURCES MENTIONS IN SHOW:

John Boyds OODA Loop

 Dr. Gary Klein's work on recognition, prime decision making

A Leader’s Framework for Decisionmaking (HBR Article co-authored by Dave Snowden)

[00:09:00] Adaptive Thinking in Policing

Lou emphasizes the need for adaptive thinking in policing, focusing on reframing problems, understanding complex dynamics, and utilizing frameworks like the OODA loop to navigate evolving situations.

Quotes:

• Lou: "In policing, you rarely encounter situations that fit into neat, predefined boxes. You need tools and frameworks that adapt in real-time to the chaos around you."
• Gary: "The transition from seeing things as 'either-or' to 'both-and' opens up creative, novel solutions that weren't initially apparent."

[00:18:00]The Role of Storytelling and Emotional Intelligence

Storytelling and emotional intelligence are highlighted as critical tools for decision-making, team building, and understanding diverse perspectives in policing.

Quotes:

• Lou: "Storytelling builds a bank of experiences we can draw from, helping us navigate new and complex situations with confidence."
• Gary: "Emotional intelligence isn't just about managing emotions but also about fostering environments where diverse perspectives come together effectively."

[00:33:00]The Intersection of Policy and Complexity

Lou and Gary discuss the limitations of rigid, policy-driven approaches in addressing complex policing scenarios. They advocate for more flexible policies that acknowledge and adapt to complexity.

Quotes:

• Lou: "Policies need to balance structure with flexibility, allowing officers to navigate both ordered and chaotic situations effectively."
• Gary: "The challenge isn't micromanagement; it's misapplied micromanagement in contexts where creativity and flexibility are required."

In this episode, I sit down with Yaron Prywes, a coaching psychologist, executive coach, and educator whose career has been dedicated to helping leaders and teams reach their full potential. We explore the transformative power of coaching—how it builds trust, unlocks self-awareness, and helps leaders navigate challenges in both public and private sectors. From resolving conflicts to fostering accountability, Yaron shares practical tools and stories that illustrate the impact of coaching. Whether you're a leader or a team member, this conversation offers valuable insights into how coaching can create meaningful change.

Yaron Prywes is a coaching psychologist, executive coach, and educator known for his innovative, visual approach to coaching. His work on visual action plans has been published in The Philosophy of Coaching: An International Journal, and he is currently authoring The Visual Coaching Handbook, which features a collection of creative, field-tested techniques. Yaron has led research on the outcomes of coaching and leadership development initiatives and previously taught Executive Coaching at Columbia University, where he supervised new coaches as they worked with live clients for the first time.

LINKEDIN

[00:00:00] Introduction and Background

• Nancy introduces Yaron, sharing the story of how they met and his dedication to coaching.

[00:03:21] Yaron’s First Experience with Coaching

• Yaron recounts his first encounter with a career coach and how it set him on his path to coaching.

[00:04:53] Sports Coaching and Workplace Coaching

• The parallels between sports coaching and executive coaching, focusing on performance adjustments.

[00:06:50] Whole-Person Coaching

• Yaron explains the importance of seeing clients as whole individuals and how personal and professional challenges intersect.

[00:08:37] Common Scenarios for Coaching in Organizations

• Typical contexts in which coaching is introduced, particularly in public sector organizations.

[00:09:24] Case Study: Hard-Charging Leader

• A story about coaching a CFO with black-and-white thinking and the importance of diplomacy.

[00:12:40] Team Workshops Using the NBI Tool

• Yaron describes the Neethling Brain Instrument (NBI) and how it helps teams understand communication styles.

[00:17:54] 360-Degree Feedback for Leaders

• The value of 360 feedback in developing leaders and creating self-awareness.

[00:22:40] Building Agency and Accountability in Teams

• Coaching to empower teams to take ownership of challenges and build accountability.

[00:29:33] Dealing with Workplace Conflict

• A case study on resolving conflict in a utilities department through coaching and team-building exercises.

[00:32:55] Transformative Conversations and Trust

• How sharing personal highs and lows can transform team dynamics and build trust.

[00:36:44] Leadership’s Role in Creating Safe Spaces

• The importance of leaders creating safe environments to surface and address issues before they escalate.

[00:39:32] The Structure of a Coaching Engagement

• Yaron outlines the typical phases of coaching: discovery, planning, and execution.

[00:42:19] Coaching as a Hero’s...